What makes a riff? A rant about "riffing"

[JetJaguar73]

The subject: YMS Commentary: I know Who Killed Me

I got 20 minutes into this and just...

<sigh>

I gave up.

Begin thoughtful think-piece rant regarding "riffing":

Are you curious to know whether or not the riffer from YMS likes going to strip clubs? Care to know if he's straight or gay? (I'm fine with either!) Find out here! Chomping at the bit to know who he name-drops and went to the club with? This is the "riff" for you! Looking for non-sequitur references to Key and Peele while the other commenters talk over each other? Do you laugh like a jackass when you hear the word "boobies"!? Have you picked up on more of the plot to the shitty movie than these guys because they haven't even bothered to watch the aforementioned shitty movie before commenting on it!? Brothers and sisters, do I have the commentary for you!

Yes, the group/channel is called Your Movie Sucks and I do suppose the idea behind this commentary is that it's a bad movie they haven't seen before, and yet I still have my problem.  Aimless chit-chat and Adam throwing shade on Lindsay Lohan for having a raspy voice are the worst. (This guy sounds like Kermit the Frog with a cattle prod firmly up his as...as I was saying, ugh.)

I'm quickly learning my love of a good riff/commentary and my utter dislike of random chatter over a movie. Mike/Joel and the Boys set the bar high. On one hand we have finely crafted deep cuts lovingly blended into a brew of juvenile humor and on the other hand...we have "Huhhh, huhhh...that actor is a big doo-doo dummy head" <laughter ensues>.
I love the conversational aspect of riffing, when it pertains to the movie, but not when it is merely the inane musings of folks who think they're too smart for your shitty movie.

A lot of the non-RT stuff falls in the middle, I'm looking at you Rooster Teeth and RLM.  The Plinkett commentaries are great as I love the dissection of a good, bad movie
The non-Plinkett commentaries aren't as fun, but still entertain. This latest YMS? Notsomuch. 

Maybe there's an audience for this, hell, there's an audience for almost everything, but jay-sus this was soooo effing tiresome. I'm sure I'll give the YMS guys yet another shot some day, just not anytime soon. Also, don't put me on blast, this is just my opinion, I'd love to hear yours. 

TLDR: Riffing fan doesn't enjoy a riff. More importantly, [i]thanks again for the upload, legit. I'm very glad to have so much riffing material available![/i]

What do y'all think about riffing in general? What makes for a good riff, and what is just noise in front of a movie?

[Coldyron]

I learned long ago to not even bother trying out these other riffing groups until I hear some good reviews from people "in the know", like those on this forum. I like old ICWXP and anything QuipTracks, as they stick very closely to the MST3K/RiffTrax model, and are both great. I've sampled many of the others and couldn't be bothered to finish most of them. As you observed, there's a difference between smart, polished riffing, and just talking over a movie to make fun of it. I guess, like so much mass media, it really comes down to the difference between something aimed at middle-schoolers and something aimed at adults. I'm an old fart, so I like the latter.

[BadFilms]

Commentary isn't synonymous with "riffing". Riffing is a form of reactionary joke (scripted or extemporaneous) that hinges upon the material being viewed, either by joking about what's taking place, mocking the material itself, creating sketch-like material in reference to what's going on or in association with it... It's like Red Letter Media. While they riff sometimes in their joking about the films they're watching, they're mostly doing commentary on the films as they watch them, all the things wrong with them, their huge failings. Maybe there are some good jokes and one-liners about the films as they're watching them, but overall their purpose is critical in nature, even if hyperbolic, and they're not designing it as being responsive to the media they're watching, so much as they're responding to each other and commenting on the qualities and flaws of the film. (And, yeah, the Plinkett commentaries are, strangely, some of the most direct critical reviews, largely because they're scripted to be that way.)

It sounds like YMS falls firmly into the "commentary" camp, but some people think that just being as mean as possible (often in unfair ways) is all you have to do to create a working comedy commentary track. (I do enjoy being unfairly mean to things on a regular basis, but you have to know how to frame it and how to pace it to make it work. Also, you have to be funny.) Even though they're kind of boring, Mike's solo commentary tracks for Legend and early Rifftrax material had a certain amount of craftsmanship around how to talk about the movies and a call/response form of interacting with dialogue and situations in the films, on top of being more like a traditional commentary track.

People doing joke commentaries on movies they've never seen seems exceptionally lazy and sloppy. If the amount of effort you're putting in is just to get some of your "funny" friends together and talk about a shitty movie as you watch it, anyone can do that. I can probably do that better than you. The real art is in watching it a few times and actually writing material, which isn't nearly as easy and requires some actual effort. I honestly don't know how these people get others to watch them do it so much. I agree that Rooster Teeth and RLM are middling as far as the actual act of making jokes about films as they're watching them, since they're taking that easy route of watching them cold; I have a bit more affection for Funhaus, as I find them funny without the movies, and RLM does their best work after watching a film - like on Best Of The Worst - when they deconstruct the myriad problems of what they've watched. (Being able to edit themselves also helps.) I have a hard time enjoying anyone outside of MKB and Bridget/Mary Jo riffing. I even found Cinematic Titanic too annoying to watch. I honestly don't know how people get through all these iRiffs and would-be comedic commentary tracks. I find most of them to be shockingly low quality and very low on comedy.

Fortunately, Rifftrax provides as much (if not more) content than I need on a regular basis, so I won't run short on stuff I enjoy anytime soon.

[JetJaguar73]

If the amount of effort you're putting in is just to get some of your "funny" friends together and talk about a shitty movie as you watch it, anyone can do that. I can probably do that better than you.

Ser Pork Vacuum,

This sums up my rant quite perfectly.  I was watching the commentary and thinking of the two people I prefer to watch bad movies with and it is true, we are way funnier.
Biased? <shrug>

But true.

[peephalk]

I have a hard time enjoying anyone outside of MKB and Bridget/Mary Jo riffing. I even found Cinematic Titanic too annoying to watch. I honestly don't know how people get through all these iRiffs and would-be comedic commentary tracks. I find most of them to be shockingly low quality and very low on comedy.
Fortunately, Rifftrax provides as much (if not more) content than I need on a regular basis, so I won't run short on stuff I enjoy anytime soon.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Kudos to you BadFilms. I tried to get that point across awhile back, and just got death threats from people too afraid to get their point across face-to-face and just hide behind anonymity. Although you said it more eloquently than I! Agree with you 100%!

[hazzychan]

I also find it difficult to watch most of the groups that have tried their hand at this form of comedy. I've always found most commentaries to be hard to sit through regardless.

But there are some riffing groups out there beyond MKB that are solid. MKB is of course the gold standard, but there are some good ones...

Quiptracks is the one I think most agree is in our top 3, no matter who the other 2 are. Really good quality writing, and sticking to the Rifftrax formula has worked very well for them.
But I also really like the quality of the jokes (though definitely NOT their recording devices) of Cinester Theater.
Riff Raff Theater has also released some really good quality riffs, though only a few that I am aware of. Same story with Drawback Productions, whose riff of Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom is top notch.

All 4 groups I routinely watch sprinkled in with my Rifftrax viewing... which is VERY heavy. I use Rifftrax as background noise/something to watch while waiting for queues/load times/etc in games, so riffs spend a LOT of time on my second screen.

The type of group you describe, JJ73, makes me think of what I might have done when I was in high school. That's not really a good thing.
I agree with BadFilms about Cinematic Titanic. I wanted to like it but it was just tiresome.

Also, as far as watching it and writing jokes or going in on the fly... if you're really quick witted, you can probably blind riff a movie decently. I don't think it would work very well as a recorded thing that people download and watch... but streaming? Something people are part of as it happens? Totally. IF you're quick-witted and funny. And whoever becomes the first giant streamer from riffing owes me a kickback.

[itsizz]

I typically agree with the OP; however, I love the Joe Bob Briggs commentaries and enjoy the RLM commentaries as well.  I do think it's great that we're spoiled for choice!

[Tost]

For the most part I can't watch anything without M,K or B in it. Even watching the new MST3K is painful most of the time. Though I will say Jonas is learning how to riff with the movie, and not try to add to it.
I can tolerate Bridget and MJ, but I mostly stay away from their stuff.

What I can't deal with is the absolute shit that gets pushed out by Matthew J. Elliott and Ian Potter. I really don't know how MKB can endorse those two. You shouldn't have to deliver 5 lines of senseless babble every 20 seconds to get a joke off.

As far as the non-RT related, as Bad Films said they're mostly commentary.

[JetJaguar73]

Welp, I just noticed that YMS has almost 1,000,000 subscribers.  Clearly I am not the target audience for these folks' commentary.
Diff'rent strokes and all that.





I still hated it.

[MarkP]

Agree that YMS is unwatchable but really enjoy the ladies and Mattew/Ian.