What kinds of planning methods do you guys use before writing a program?

[RobertX]

After thinking about the next program to write as a pet project, I have become completely burnt out; I can't determine the best way to plan the coding for a program.

I have writing thousands of pages of pseudo codes and, one day, tore them up in frustration. I don't have the skills to properly write a Java GUI
program.

I guess I should not have skipped kindergarten.

For those who have/had problems like those, I would welcome your reflections. Maybe following advice would steer me back on course.

[Kingfish]

What was the last program you made?

[RobertX]

I've been trying to code an alarm clock program using Java, just a simple one.

I've been trying to plan through using pseudo code on paper, but I tore it up because it's too long and I made too many mistakes.

I'll try again, but I am still open to suggestions as to what is a good way to plan before programming.

[hockey97]

I've been trying to code an alarm clock program using Java, just a simple one.

I've been trying to plan through using pseudo code on paper, but I tore it up because it's too long and I made too many mistakes.

I'll try again, but I am still open to suggestions as to what is a good way to plan before programming.

Why not hire a programmer to do that for you? Maybe programming isn't for you?  I have well over 10 years experience programming software from OS, to hardware to actual windows and linux programs.  I have helped people learn programming. However, people that start normally don't have issues like you.  I suggest you start back doing smaller things. Build your way up. It looks like you're trying to do projects without actually knowing how to code works.

Which many at first they want to make the best next video game. Yet, they think instead of learning they will do the project while they're learning programming. which is fine by me but it will take you many years before completing the project if you can learn the material. 

Most cannot do this and instead I ask people to start small like when you click a button make something happen. Then build on and onto it. Then try and work with audio and then try and work with video / graphics. 

It's all about building steps. If you just try and make a project where you lack the skills to understand what you need to do in the start. Then you will be doing exactly what you're doing which is wasting time. You're putting tons and tons of code that makes no sense where you end up starting back at scratch. It tells me flat out you don't know the inner workings of the code which is why you're making a crappy file of code that have bugs or doesn't work.

I suggest to you either quit or buy a book or go online and watch videos of people coding and how they code things. Then copy them and make similar projects. Once you understand what the code does you can slowly build onto that knowledge. Don't go to the next stage untill you fully understand it.

[RobertX]

I'm not doing a big-ass project, just "small stuff," like a simple clock program and I don't need a programmmer.

I was just looking for advice on how to plan; I have some ideas, but I thought I'd combine other people's advice.

I don't need to give money to someone to do my homework for me.

Wrong of me to ask. Sorry.

EDIT: Just to add, I just need advice on how to plan out a program before I code it. I am aware of the fact that most programmers, especially reasonably-adept ones, just start coding right away. That may work for small programs, but once they move higher and higher, they lose control of their code and go blind like a bat.

Now, I don't want or require special treatment, I don't need to be babied, I can very well wipe my ass by myself, thank you. The reason I ask is that I can create a discussion, and at the same time, learn something.

Thank you for your advice, but I think I'll try again, by myself.

[AncientRome]

Start with the questions below.
Come up with functions and variables you might want to use.
If you're just doing homework for a school class, define variables, create functions, use functions/display result.

If you're stuck, take a look at other peoples codes. Take it apart, examine it and try to figure out how it works and what it's doing.

Code:

What do I want to make?
What language am I going to use?
What purpose will my program serve?
Would others find it useful?
How big is my project?
Can I complete a framework right away or will it take time?
What do I know and can complete right [u]now[/u]?
What should I prioritize first?

[hockey97]

I'm not doing a big-ass project, just "small stuff," like a simple clock program and I don't need a programmmer.

I was just looking for advice on how to plan; I have some ideas, but I thought I'd combine other people's advice.

I don't need to give money to someone to do my homework for me.

Wrong of me to ask. Sorry.

EDIT: Just to add, I just need advice on how to plan out a program before I code it. I am aware of the fact that most programmers, especially reasonably-adept ones, just start coding right away. That may work for small programs, but once they move higher and higher, they lose control of their code and go blind like a bat.

Now, I don't want or require special treatment, I don't need to be babied, I can very well wipe my ass by myself, thank you. The reason I ask is that I can create a discussion, and at the same time, learn something.

Thank you for your advice, but I think I'll try again, by myself.

No, it's not because you wanted to create a discussion. If you did you would go to websites that have programmers that talk about these kinds of things and would ask it in a different way. You asked for specifics that relate to your issue. 

Again I commented to help you.  This is the first time I have ever seen someone ask such a question. I taught myself how to program and never had to ask anyone how to plan and brain storm to write  a program.  I asked specific questions to programming concepts. 

The feeling I get from you is that you don't know how to code. You know how to copy and paste other peoples code and modify it to work. Yet, never can do it on your own. Which means you never mastered the concepts taught for programming.  If you did you wouldn't need to ask such a question on how to plan a project.

You said an alarm clock. If you understood functions and variables and learned classes. I can do this in a couple of minutes but depends how fancy of an alarm clock. 

There's no real need to plan.  What is an alarm clock? well you need to use current time as input and alarm set time as input. The output would be playing an audio file.

For someone like you I would first write the code in skeleton form. Get current time and then set alarm time. 

Then write logic code  for conditions when met to display text that says alarm gone off.  Once I got all that code working. Then I would  changed the text to playing an audio file maybe a beep.wave file.

Once, those work. Then you can focus on making it more appealing maybe create some neat graphics and an advance GUI.  Or maybe use excel files to add multiple alarms  or maybe add in possible alarm clocks for baking or something.


Planning is not hard. I personally would break the project down to simple concepts. For your example an alarm clock what does an alarm clock do? what functions does it need?  What are the inputs and outputs.  Inputs are current time, and set time   and outputs would be to generate  a sound when the current time = set time. 

It's really not at all hard. So, for you to ask it would mean you have no clue what you're doing and it's due to the fact that you never mastered the programmatic concepts. I mean if you have trouble figuring out what to do to code a simple alarm clock. I suggest you go back and re-read the books on your programming language that you're about to use. Understand the concepts first before moving onto projects. 

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I'm not doing a big-ass project, just "small stuff," like a simple clock program and I don't need a programmmer.

I was just looking for advice on how to plan; I have some ideas, but I thought I'd combine other people's advice.

I don't need to give money to someone to do my homework for me.

Wrong of me to ask. Sorry.

EDIT: Just to add, I just need advice on how to plan out a program before I code it. I am aware of the fact that most programmers, especially reasonably-adept ones, just start coding right away. That may work for small programs, but once they move higher and higher, they lose control of their code and go blind like a bat.

Now, I don't want or require special treatment, I don't need to be babied, I can very well wipe my ass by myself, thank you. The reason I ask is that I can create a discussion, and at the same time, learn something.

Thank you for your advice, but I think I'll try again, by myself.

If you want people to help you then don't be so vague. Telling us you have some ideas. You should spell out your ideas. Again you said you started this thread to start a discussion for everyone.  However, you suppress your own contribution to the forum. By saying you have some ideas and not spelling them out. How can we help you when you don't let us know exactly where you're at.

again I  have never heard anyone having issues on planning a project. The only ones that have these issues are people that think they can use people to code for them for free or those that copy and past other peoples code without fully understanding how it works. However, they put it in a certain way they know it works. 

It's like going to class and cheating off the smart kid. You ace your exam but you have no merit to back up your a with your own brain.  It's important to learn the concepts of what you're doing in order to move forward with it. I can tell you have spend months doing projects that never end up being finished and it's due to the fact you never understood the concepts. 

[RobertX]

All right, thanks guys.

Sorry for the stupid question.

[AncientRome]

It's not a stupid question. Some people don't like to plan ahead and just dive in, that's the way I am.

If you're programming for the expansion of knowledge, try focusing on your weaknesses in programming, that way your skills increase and will make things easier to do in the future.

Taking other peoples code and taking it apart to see how it works isn't cheating, it's how people reverse engineer and learn things without needing books or official training. Think of it as experiencing the code rather than simply being told what it is. And most of the time, they are just bare-bones examples/samples and meant to be added onto.

[RobertX]

Here's how I did it in the past:

- determine what I am going to do
- determine the features
- determine what kinds of research that must be done, like how to make a GUI, how to program buttons, etc.
- write out the code in paper
- actually code it (and test the code in each degree of completion)
- document (i.e. comment)

You see, I already graduated in college with a diploma in computer programming, but they don't teach everything. I guess it's up to me to learn the missing bits, and that's what I intend to do.

Thank you hockey and thank you AncientRome; your inputs were useful. I will make a program worthy of your respect.