(Apr 07, 2014, 05:25 am)stormium Wrote: yes, the man was illegally camping in an open space area that was set aside for protection and conservation and doesn't contain any public facilities other than trails... which is very different from a state or national park in which camping may be permitted in certain areas.
what you see in the video is one man surrounded by several police officers and their dog.
so, the reason why the police were there is because someone noticed this guy camping where he wasn't supposed to be camping and notified the police.
Heaven forbid shot for illegal camping. IE: He wasn't bothering anyone and minding his own business. Sorry but there's no excusing or justification possible for what happened to that man.
It's the age old question of who the hell gives them the right to put a sign and keep people out. If you're not hurting or bothering anyone then you should have the right to be left alone.
(Apr 07, 2014, 09:39 am)Guest Wrote: Heaven forbid shot for illegal camping. IE: He wasn't bothering anyone and minding his own business. Sorry but there's no excusing or justification possible for what happened to that man.
It's the age old question of who the hell gives them the right to put a sign and keep people out. If you're not hurting or bothering anyone then you should have the right to be left alone.
there's a perfectly good excuse for what happened. don't dick the cops around for more than three hours and then go for a weapon because you know what... you're going to get shot and to answer your age old question... same goes for bestiality... right? if they sheep enjoy getting fucked, you should be allowed to fuck all the sheep you want, right? that's what you are saying, isn't it? you aren't bothering anyone and you are minding your own business.
no, sir. i don't think so. i'm not interested in any logic that promotes sheep fucking, ruining open spaces or anarchy in general.
(Apr 07, 2014, 07:22 am)Kingfish Wrote: We can all watch the video and we can all see the man walking away and being shot in the back and that is not rational especially given they had dogs and non lethal rounds with them that for some reason they decided would be better used once he was dead.
i don't know what video you watched but in the video i've watched, i can see beanbag guns being fired, and a dog being released. i then see a man brandish two knives and direct his attention towards the dog and it's handler. i then see the police open fire with their semi-automatic ar-15s.
so, yeah... what video have you been watching?
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(Apr 07, 2014, 13:12 pm)stormium Wrote: there's a perfectly good excuse for what happened. don't dick the cops around for more than three hours and then go for a weapon because you know what..
Yea well if the cops "had to show up" for whatever stupid reason they had. They should have just seen the guy wasn't bothering anyone and then left him be in peace.
And we've all heard more than enough of the "anarchist" threat. Sorry to say this but it's a load of crap. There are no barbarian hoards waiting to attack the moment we show someone a little leniency.
PS. That was me that posted as guest (forgot to log in)
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(Apr 07, 2014, 13:12 pm)stormium Wrote: i don't know what video you watched but in the video i've watched, i can see beanbag guns being fired, and a dog being released. i then see a man brandish two knives and direct his attention towards the dog and it's handler. i then see the police open fire with their semi-automatic ar-15s.
so, yeah... what video have you been watching?
The video on post one that clearly shows a flash round being fired followed immediately by several shots from a machine gun that killed the camper then afterwords some bean bags were fired and a dog set loose, having a knife does not mean an officer is entitled to gun you down with a machine gun as the officer could have reasonably moved away because as everyone can see there was no bystanders to get hurt, are you one of these pro gun nuts that thinks its acceptable to mow people down with a machine gun just because he had a knife?
The police have batons and dogs and non lethal rounds to deal with situations like that and in this situation all the non lethal tools were at hand so no execution was necessary.
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I know everyone wants to judge the police and say they used excessive force or whatever, but it isn't as easy to determine in a split second what to do, as everyone makes it out to be.
He did have weapons and was threatening police and if you were faced with a man with known mental problems and a known criminal history and brandishing a knife, you may have shot him too.
The police don't have the benefit of reviewing a video and saying 'Well, we should shoot this guy now, he is dangerous', or 'He is safe and we should just tackle him', they have to decide immediately and if they decide wrong, innocent people can die.
I'm not saying this guy should have been killed, only that it isn't as clearcut as everyone seems to think. Police put their lives on the line every day and we should try to remember that before we condemn them for what they do.
So were they wrong to kill this guy? Probably. But hindsight is 20/20 as they say.
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Apr 08, 2014, 14:53 pm
(This post was last modified: Apr 08, 2014, 14:54 pm by tuffgong. Edited 1 time in total.)
(Apr 07, 2014, 14:58 pm)joew771 Wrote: Police put their lives on the line every day and we should try to remember that before we condemn them for what they do.
Having family members in Law Enforcement I couldn't agree more.
But....
"Since 2010, Albuquerque police have shot 37 people, 23 of them fatally. The shootings have prompted the U.S. Justice Department to open an investigation into police conduct." SOURCE
Training and re-training are critical to ensure the safety of both the public AND police force. It would seem Albuquerque needs some.
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Apparently, he had it coming... The US has a zero tolerance policy. If you somehow threaten a cop, they are allowed to kill you. Most of the time this stuff is not on video.
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Apr 10, 2014, 09:04 am
(This post was last modified: Apr 10, 2014, 09:10 am by ViperScale. Edited 2 times in total.)
(Apr 07, 2014, 06:47 am)Kingfish Wrote: (Apr 07, 2014, 06:42 am)stormium Wrote: the rational defense is that there was police officer within striking distance both knives that boyd pulled from his person when the other officers fired on him. a police officer can use lethal force to protect themselves and others when they perceive a need to do so; that's the law.
That's bullshit, we have all watched the video of the man walking away then being gunned down by a machine gun, the fact that you freely admit he had a knife and was then executed by a gun shows a disproportionate use of force and the correct course of action would have been to use the dog or the bean bag rounds first rather than after the execution.
It is not rational to shoot a man in the back for simply holding a knife when he was walking away form the officers.
A machine gun? maybe you need to learn what that is????? Here we go again with people talking shit about stuff they have no clue about just like the news people in the video.
This is like watching a video of someone sky diving that died and watching the video you go hey the rip chord was right over there. Well when you are falling you don't always have the time to say hey there is the rip chord that isn't where i thought it was going to be, let me just reach over there and pull it. I think for the most part they try to do the best they can, every day mistakes are made, it just happens when you are dealing with life and dead mistakes sometimes can be worst. Most people when faces with a questionable position that could result in their death their co-worker's dead or someone else's death will likely pick the someone elses's death.
(fyi i don't really like cops, necessary evil sometimes though)
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(Apr 10, 2014, 09:04 am)ViperScale Wrote: A machine gun? maybe you need to learn what that is????? Here we go again with people talking shit about stuff they have no clue about just like the news people in the video.
This is like watching a video of someone sky diving that died and watching the video you go hey the rip chord was right over there. Well when you are falling you don't always have the time to say hey there is the rip chord that isn't where i thought it was going to be, let me just reach over there and pull it. I think for the most part they try to do the best they can, every day mistakes are made, it just happens when you are dealing with life and dead mistakes sometimes can be worst. Most people when faces with a questionable position that could result in their death their co-worker's dead or someone else's death will likely pick the someone elses's death.
(fyi i don't really like cops, necessary evil sometimes though)
Is an automatic weapon not a machine gun or just not today to allow you to split hairs?
Your analogy is bizarre to say the least but there is nothing you can say or do that will alter the fact that the execution was completely unnecessary, the police could have contained him and just waited as after all there was no rush.
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