USSF - United States Space Force

[ill88eagle]

I regret not reading the works of Chinese Philosophers, simply because I tried learning it in Chinese and can't make heads or tails.

When translated, most works differ from their original counterparts because of the poor translation. Chinese and English are two very different languages, and, coming from someone who speaks both languages, I would know that.

Because I still can't understand most Chinese speech (and even if I did, I wouldn't understand old Chinese), this deficiency is my loss.

What did you like about Lzo Tzu?

And on a noteworthy reminder: Don't miss Star Trek Discovery Season Three on CBS All-Access!

Actually I like Zhuang Zi better but ole Lao lays the truth out in a simpler way

[RobertX]

You mean the "Art of War" Sun Tzu?

[ill88eagle]

You mean the "Art of War" Sun Tzu?

No. I get confused with different chinese spelling... I mean butterfly dream paradox guy

https://web.archive.org/web/200401011537...ngtzu.html

Hui Tzu said to Chuang Tzu, "I have a big tree of the kind men call shu. Its trunk is too gnarled and bumpy to apply a measuring line to, its branches too bent and twisty to match up to a compass or square. You could stand it by the road and no carpenter would look at it twice. Your words, too, are big and useless, and so everyone alike spurns them!"

Chuang Tzu said, "Maybe you've never seen a wildcat or a weasel. It crouches down and hides, watching for something to come along. It leaps and races east and west, not hesitating to go high or low-until it falls into the trap and dies in the net. Then again there's the yak, big as a cloud covering the sky. It certainly knows how to be big, though it doesn't know how to catch rats. Now You have this big tree and you're distressed because it's useless. Why don't you plant it in Not-Even-Anything Village, or the field of Broad-and-Boundless, relax and do nothing by its side, or lie down for a free and easy sleep under it? Axes will never shorten its life, nothing can ever harm it. If there's no use for it, how can it come to grief or pain?"

[RobertX]

OK.

Yeah, Chinese spelling is more adventurous when it comes to people from Hong Kong (Cantonese) and the Mainland (largely Mandarin).

My mother's maiden name is 林.

In Cantonese, it's called "Lam," Like Carrie Lam. In Mandarin, it's "Lin." It depends on which dialect it's translated in.

Any how, back to the topic.

I guess the argument of whether the UFP is militant is relevant or not, though I don't think Gene Roddenberry leans that way. Of course, the later Star Trek stories are not of his approval, like DS9, VOY, ENT, DIS, and PIC. If a guy picks a fight with you and pulls out a knife. What would you do? If you are an accomplished diplomat, I would understand that you would try to talk him out as a way to prevent violence. But what if he insists? You see, I too believe that killing in self defence is logical, but I also believe in not making a mess out of the situation.

I think Roddenberry would believe that as well. Just ask him.

[dueda]

Section 31.
They use weapons only for self defence; as the prime universe Captain Georgiou said: "Starfleet doesn't fire first."

Basically what Stormium said. Loading doesn't means you're a soldier or aggressor, just that you're ready; but having such protocol by design, in big numbers, means something.
Starfleet could be seen as the exploration and transport branch which will double as police and/or military as needed.

Wasn't Starfleet in war with the Klingons?
War in google as being defined as

War is a situation or a period of fighting between countries or groups of people. A war generally involves the use of weapons, a military organization and soldiers. War is a situation in which a nation enforces its rights by using force. Not every armed conflict is a war.

I always thought they were a military force, on a mission of peace representing the government of the United Federation of Planets

For what I know Starfleet was in armed conflict in half the episodes from all series, and a few wars, The Romulans (so the neutral zone) being well known.
Kirk was the typical cowboy, so was Archer; Cisco and Picard being more diplomatic; and Jane... Well, she didn't really fit the concept. It was a "let's try something different, tone down, aim at the female public..." kind of BS.

[RobertX]

Well, it is fiction, so everything is open to interpretation.

Even life itself is an exercise in perspective. You can say the sky is blue, purple, with Skittles, you can say that the Jews helped the British conquer the Triple Alliance.

I would recommend watching TNG's third season episode "A Matter of Perspective." In this episode, Riker is charged for murder for killing a certain Dr. Apgar due to disagreements. In his trial, all witnesses came forward and told their story. You know what? Their stories all differ. Counsellor Troi senses that all witnesses and the defendant were not in the business of deception.

I thought Sisko was darker than Picard! Just kidding, partially. In all seriousness, Sisko was the war general, and Picard was always the diplomat.

Now, back to watching NJPW G1 Climax 29.

[dueda]

If I remember it right, Sisco was caught in a very militarized situation as the Cardasians just left their occupation outpost (renamed Deep Space 9 by the Federation) but didn't give up, amongst other things.
Being in the middle of a backyard guerrilla war turned mass invasion alongside an eternal dispute between godlike entities from another dimension, made him act accordingly, I guess.
But I understand he always wanted peace and as much as possible tried to talk people to a mutually beneficial agreement.

[RobertX]

But he also declared war on the Dominion when so many formerly great powers in the Alpha Quadrant signed non-aggression pacts with the Dominion. He mined the entrance to the wormhole and because he did that, he has shown that he means war.

But you're right, all he wants is peace and stability.

[dueda]

But he also declared war on the Dominion
> I guess it was a matter of time. He just didn't wait.

when so many formerly great powers in the Alpha Quadrant signed non-aggression pacts with the Dominion.
> The friend of my enemy... What is good for uncle CardaSAM isn't necessarily best for me. And as you said, they were powers, the Federation didn't want to be Dominated, always try to keep their edge.

He mined the entrance to the wormhole and because he did that, he has shown that he means war.
> Cluster mines, toy-shaped mines, boobytrap mines, and pressure-release mines are just part of any modern army's arsenal, nothing to worry about except irresponsible parents letting their kids roam unsupervised.
> But think of it as a fence or wall, it's there to avoid conflict.

But you're right, all he wants is peace and stability.
> And so did Winston (Churchill), but that was not an option.

[theSEMAR]

maybe anyone interested in reading the results of their discussion:
https://www.afspc.af.mil/Portals/3/The%2...3Oct19.pdf